on triggers and warnings

[green]

I am getting so fucking irate at people over this warnings wank. Seriously. Livid.

What people aren't getting, or aren't wanting to get, is that people are actually HURT over getting triggered. Triggers aren't like squicks, they're HURTFUL.

An example: My dad was triggered by Desert Storm. He had PTSD from his time in Vietnam. After Desert Storm started, he couldn't eat or sleep, and reverted to self-medicating with alcohol and other drugs. It's what broke apart my parents' marriage. So, you know, war was his trigger.

That's what triggers do. Sometimes they knock you down so far you can't see any way out of it. I have PTSD too, and I've been triggered unknowingly. I didn't know what put me down so far. I couldn't eat, I couldn't sleep, all I could do was RP (badly) for days on end. I had to actually talk it out to figure what had made me panic. It turned out it was something my girlfriend had done, unknowingly, and it freaked me out so badly I was put into hypervigilance - jumping at every sound, unable to eat or sleep, like a prolonged panic attack - for about two weeks. I lost that relationship because I couldn't even TALK about what was wrong. (and if you are reading this, Lisa, I love you and I'm so, so sorry)

Triggers can be sounds, tastes, smells. They can also be words. Words are powerful, as any good writer should know.

No, you don't HAVE to put warnings on your fic. There's no fandom police who will come arrest you. You can be a total douchebag and let other people get hurt because you didn't warn. You also open yourself up to fandom coming down on you for not warning.

But why would you want to? Why would you want to actually HURT someone else when it takes two seconds to type out a warning? If it spoils the story, put it in whitetext with 'warnings/spoilers' next to it. HP fandom does this very well.

AND ANOTHER THING.

I am mad as hell over some people saying that impertinence is a "professional victim" or an attention whore. What she did and continues to do is incredibly brave and powerful. That goes for everyone else who has spoken up and said 'hey, I'm a survivor, and here is how you are hurting me'.

I posted about this a couple of days ago talking about my particular triggers, but I privated it shortly after I posted. I didn't want to be talked to the way some people are talking to Imp. I don't want my experiences pat-patted and then trudged all over. Opening up about past abuse is HARD, and it leaves you bare and naked and exposed for the world to see. I've done it before, but I don't feel like doing it again, especially after seeing what's happened to Imp. I'm sorry, but I'm just not that fucking brave.

Comments

[coolrainkiss]

I just don't understand this wank at all because it makes no sense.

But bb, just for making THIS post, just for getting up everyday, just for being you means you are very brave, no comparison, okay? ♥

[green]

♥

ILU

[noxie]

Basically, you've just said everything I've been wanting to say on the subject myself. Go you! *hugs!*

[green]

*hugs*

[fairestcat]

*hugs*

And actually, just saying "I see what you're doing to her, I'm not going to set myself up for the same" IS brave.

It's calling people out on their behavior and that's a brave thing to do.

[green]

I don't feel very brave. I think I've left one comment about this (that wasn't anon) and then I backed off pretty fast because it's so hurtful. One of my flisters is arguing that it's about freedom to not warn, and I just. I don't have the spoons for that discussion.

[darkmoon]

What happened?!?!?!?

Seriously, I thought that everything from Rape to Incest had to have warnings. On one of my fics, it's a Roswell, I bolded that the fic involved a rape, and character death. Because people need to be warned about things like that. You can't just surprise them! That's horrific! I thought any community worth it's salt had a rule that Warnings must be used.

I feel lost, confused, and pissed at the idea that if this is about someone not using warnings, How the fuck dare they?!!?! People not only have triggers, but they have squicks, and they have a right to be warned if something has questionable content.

I believe warnings is what separates us from fanfiction.net because we are at least, what I thought was Adult, to not to be policed.

[green]

There's a debate that's been going on for about a week over this. It started in bandom when someone posted a fic with dub-con in it and didn't warn, was called out on it (politely, from what I gather), and then put up a warning. THEN some people came in (who had nothing to do with the original story) and decided warnings weren't a rule and no one should have to put warnings on their stories. Impertinence posted in her LJ about her own experiences with being sexually abused and what being triggered is like, and a lot of people are treating her horribly for daring to say warnings are a good thing. I just. UGH.

There's a post up at unfunnybusiness on Journalfen with links, and it's been all over metafandom.

[darkmoon]

These are the days that I hate humanity. People are assholes. And I think Impertinence is very brave for posting about her experience.

[gloss]

God, I hope people who *need* some learning will read this post -- you are brave and compassionate and just so fucking *beautiful* -- though I'm pretty much convinced at this point that they don't *want* to learn anything. I saw your earlier post and I'm glad you privated it; the way Impertinence is being spoken to and spoken about is making me ill. Like you and the other survivors who've spoken up, she's a stunning, amazing person and I feel lucky to share space -- however tangentially -- with you all.

[green]

*hugs so hard* Thank you.

[elucidate_this]

though I'm pretty much convinced at this point that they don't *want* to learn anything.

I agree. I think at this stage in the discussion the people who are still making noise aren't going to change their mind. And I think in some cases they are being willfully obtuse. And that is very very frustrating.

[saifai]

I understand you, and I hope this post helps those that truly don't understand why it's an issue. *hugs*

[green]

I think a lot of people are digging their heels in at this point and just refusing to hear what we have to say, which is really fucking disappointing.

*hugs*

[rhaegal]

Seriously, there are no words for how much I burn with rage that this wank is still showing up on my flist. I just cannot understand the viewpoint of anyone who wants to deliberately and knowingly hurt people in the name of fandom, which is supposed to be a f***ing hobby, you know?

It is also incredibly angry-making that people are being called attention whores for explaining their triggers. I have wanted so very badly to wade into this discussion and explain to these morons how it feels to be reminded of bring raped as a child when you're trying to indulge yourself in something you do for fun, but the fear that someone might call it attention-whoring has stopped me. It makes me very sad indeed that other people more brave than I am are having to deal with that.

Sorry, I just realised I've essentially repeated your post but less eloquently. Have a *hug* instead.

[green]

*hugs* Thank you. It's good to know you understand.

[elz]

I'm sorry you and impertinence and everybody else has to deal with all of this. *hugs*

[green]

*hugs* Thankfully I haven't had to deal with a lot. I've gotten really upset over the wank, but I haven't had to deal with what Imp has.

[elucidate_this]

*hugs*

this has been so very very fucking brutal. I can't understand people's responses to this at all. particularly their responses to imp. i pretty much hate everyone right now.

[green]

I am disappointed in a lot of people and very angry at some others. And it's gone on long enough that I don't think anyone's going to change their minds, they're just digging their heels in, and patting themselves on the back for being ... whatever it is they think they're being. >:(

*hugs*

[amymccabe]

(((HUGS)))

I don't have triggers. I don't have nearly as much trauma in my past. I've had a hard time talking about this it has upset me so much. I have a lot of respect for a lot of people right now. Unfortunately I'm also gaining a lot of contempt for a lot of people right now too. They deserve it though.

[fannishnonsense]

This whole thing has been horrific. I can't believe some people think it's OK to attack a survivor like that.

[meallanmouse]

...moral and ethical laziness are just that - and trying to cover it up under the flag of "oh, my freedom" is asinine.

:: sigh ::

I'm sorry you and yours have to be sujected to such rampant stupidity. :(

:: hugs ::

[cynaravurzyn.livejournal.com]

I'm just going to step in here with a little devil's advocacy. I can see why some people don't want to put warnings on specific fics. What I do is put blanket warnings on my website, and additional warnings on links.

Now, that said, I completely understand that some readers need warnings. For my friends, if I'm told what they can't handle, I'll let them know if a piece would be a no go, or if they should have another friend pre-read it.

[scorpionvoices]

You ARE that brave; you said something about it, you defended another person even though you don't want to get tarred with the same brush by people who should know better. That is the very *definition* of brave. Your bravery may be different than Imp's, but it is still very present.

[rap541]

No, you don't HAVE to put warnings on your fic. There's no fandom police who will come arrest you. You can be a total douchebag and let other people get hurt because you didn't warn. You also open yourself up to fandom coming down on you for not warning.

In all seriousness, what are the official warnings? You know, the official warnings that need to be in place in order to not be a total douchebag and that don't open me up to all fandom coming down onto me for not warning?

What warnings are *official* and where do I go to know what the official "Yer not a douchebag as long as these are up on your fics" list is?

I am asking this in all seriousness. I warn for rape and incest, but if there's an official list that means I can avoid being an official fandom douchebag... point me to that list since I don't know.

There's no fandom police, but obviously there's a way to be an official douchebag, so where is the official list so people *know* how to not be an official fandom douchebag? I assume you know since you know what a total douchebag to fandom is and you have no problem threatening how fandom will come down on total douchebags who don't follow the official fandom list?